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Living in a Beta universe? (coffee break fun)
  • We're always torturing our brains in these forums, so I thought I'd ask a more philosophical question just for fun.

    As programmers, architects, musicians, artists, etc... we all create stuff. And, as creators, we usually start by doing sketches or Beta versions before reaching our final product. This got me thinking that if there is a god (I'm not sure, but this poll assumes so) then he/she/it must also follow this principle.

    Do you think we are living in a Beta version of the Universe?
    1 - yes
    0 - no

    Personally, I say yes (1) this is a Beta version and hopefully all the bugs will be fixed for the final release. I'd like Durians to taste better for one thing.
  • I would say it is rather an alpha version
  • Not sure about what version were at but I'd say it is definitely an application hosted in the cloud.

    Perhaps we are on the staging cloud (cloud 8) and the final version will be cloud 9?

    (Opinionated aside: I find it hilarious how loads of big companies are releasing new websites to the public with 'Beta' tags on just because it looks cool or goes some way to excusing the fact that it hasn't be tested properly yet. It is a technical term that has been pounced on by marketing and widely misused - just like 'the cloud'.

    Sorry, rant over. Let's get back to the poll!)

  • I have to agree with zsolt, definitely an alpha version. There is a lot of room for improvement!
  • "You are perfect just the way you are, and you could use a little improvement." Suzuki Roshi

  • Posted By: xenakis

    Personally, I say yes (1) this is a Beta version and hopefully all the bugs will be fixed for the final release.



    This is very optimistic outlook. Malfunctioning proof of concept I would say.
  • Who says final versions are properly tested and problem free? ;)
  • I have also some other questions:
    Is the universe based on mvc or hmvc? Procedural or oo code? Will be the final release opensource?
  • I would say the universe is based on code that can learn and modify its own self. Self aware code?
  • God doesn't exist. As humans we reach a general equlibrium due to our general perception of utopia, but due to the nature of Chaos Theory and the completely random nature of our universe, true perfection can never be reached. Therefore there cannot be a constant revision to a defined point, but more a never ending harmonic swing, constantly swinging in before and beyond the theoretical point of perfection.

    Thats my perception of it anyway.
  • I know I had major trouble booting up this morning. I think last night's drinking has corrupted some core system files.


  • but due to the nature of Chaos Theory and the completely random nature of our universe, true perfection can never be reached.


    This might indeed be one of many fundamental flaws in the universe's design indicating to us that it is in a 'test' version. Like I said, the bad taste of Durians would be another. Maybe these limiting properties could be shed in a future version of the universe allowing it to become 'perfect'. I just hope I'll be called again to be a Beta tester. I rather like it.
  • If the world was perfect, we would loose all sense of ambition. What would there be to live for, if you had all you ever wanted, the way you wanted it? We have evolved based on the un-perfected nature of our world, and to change that so suddenly would cause more problems then it would solve imo.
  • can I have the svn access to the source code of the universe pls? and btw what's the url for the issue tracker?
  • @Lukman - Unfortunately, it's not open source. There are a lot of people trying to reverse engineer though.
  • One thing's for sure: Darwinian Bug-fixing takes way too long. I would have liked to see improvements in my lifetime.
  • 0 - The Universe is definitively not Beta, nor is it versioned.

    It's a once-off, original product, with a vast feature set and one known bug. Written entirely in machine code.

    Naturally, it can only be run from the command line ;)

    The Universe is not random. The concept of "random" is applicable for analysis of finite data sets.

    Now, if I could just work out how that [email protected]$ted bug got in there ...

  • I think somebody has a leaked version of the source code, just search for the torrent
  • Posted By: Sabot
    Posted By: xenakis

    Personally, I say yes (1) this is a Beta version and hopefully all the bugs will be fixed for the final release.

    This is very optimistic outlook. Malfunctioning proof of concept I would say.



    Indeed, at times, it seems like it's just a discarded 'tech-demo' which just didn't seem to work well enough..
  • So it could be my lack of sleep, but I re-read this thread again with interest, thinking again about the original question in relation to some of the responses here.

    It's interesting to note the interpretations, humour, and dis-satisfaction expressed about "what is" (durians, perfection, final releases, Darwin, bug fixes, bloat) and here's my take:

    1. None of us, for sure, will be around for any supposed universe final release, so no point devoting processor cycles to that
    2. The concept of beta, final, perfection, bugs, happiness or unhappiness is all entirely relative anyway
    3. Beta or not, the only thing we have real input over is ourselves
    4. You see the Universe through filters of your own making

    Which leads me to think that on all practical levels it is actually it is us, not the Universe, who are in Beta!

    All individually listening, reviewing, updating, bug fixing, and hopefully adding new features along the way. And actually The "Final Release" will be just that, which is a great reminder to make the most of this wonderful Beta Experience whilst you've got it :)

  • Posted By: Dave Stewart

    Which leads me to think that on all practical levels it is actually it isus, not the Universe, who are in Beta!


    Sounds plausible, considering that humans have (or are believed to have) evolved from apes. So, if apes can be considered as alpha version and human is beta, what would the final version of us would be? Superman? Super Saiya? Or Ultraman?
  • Ah, well I meant on a slightly more philosophical level, with your life being your very own personal "beta":

    Birth (Alpha) Life (Beta) Death (Release) |-------------------------------------------->|

    And generally making it as productive as you can, with most of use likely bug-fixing right up until the very end :)

  • @Dave Stewart - Unfortunately, your argument stands for the soul (if (soul != NULL)) and the mind. The body seems to reach a final version much earlier and degenerates until death.

    Heidegger said something like this - "If we could experience our life to the fullest, the on-going minute by minute (second by second) decay of our body would be part of that experience".
  • @Dave Stewart
    Posted By: Dave StewartBirth (Alpha) Life (Beta) Death (Release) |-------------------------------------------->|

    that is correct, LOL

    but what is with reincarnation?
    Birth v01 (Alpha) Life v01 (Beta) Death v01 (Release)
    |-------------------------------------------->|
    Birth v02 (Alpha) Life v02 (Beta) Death v02 (Release)
    |-------------------------------------------->|
  • Posted By: zsolt

    but what is with reincarnation?



    I think the current reincarnation driver must be buggy, as my experience of life so far is that it's stateless! Whoever had me last time obviously didn't set the right $_SESSION variable...
  • Now the topic is getting more like 'matrix trilogy' theory to me.

    Universe is an os. We human are the software in it. Old software are buggy and should be remove - replaced with a new one.

    In kohana terms - can I say that we (the creator) are modules - to add more color to the system so it goes better?

    But one thing will surely become question... modules are vary... you can choose either to use or not.

    So what if "YOU" are not that useful? What should the creator do? Get rid of "YOU"? LOL.....
  • Posted By: zsolt

    @Dave Stewart

    Posted By: Dave Stewart

    Birth (Alpha) Life (Beta) Death (Release) |-------------------------------------------->|

    that is correct, LOL

    but what is with reincarnation?

    Birth v01 (Alpha) Life v01 (Beta) Death v01 (Release) |-------------------------------------------->| Birth v02 (Alpha) Life v02 (Beta) Death v02 (Release) |-------------------------------------------->|


    In some cases, deja vu happens. What should we call that? Uncleared old cache I think.... LOL....
  • Do you think we are living in a Beta version of the Universe?

    Technically that would be against the hole "perfect creator" thing.

    Well, if I were to humor the idea for a sec: I think we're living in the paper tissue sketch, and God is sleeping his drunk self next to us.

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